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Малые корабли альтерн. ВМФ СССР (продолжение)

von Echenbach: Появилась идея поиграть с малыми кораблями, как в СССР, так и др. стран. К малым кораблям можно отнести, вероятно, от КЛ и ниже: КЛ, Дес. корабли, ТЩ, малые (?) МЗ, БРКА, СКА, ТКА, КТЩ и м.б. малые - до 150-200 т, ПЛ. В проектах и ТТЗ можно применять послезнание, но в комплектации - опираться на реально имевшиеся технологические возможности.

Ответов - 75, стр: 1 2 3 4 All

dr5r1: Очень близкие. Рамзин нафиг. Без самого Рамзина котёл не регулируется.

von Echenbach: Тогда строим эти дизели АЧ-30 и м-50, и принимаем на поток. Топливо по качеству какое и сколько имеется-нужно сделать? Снабжение в этой Аи: с самоходных типовых барж-танкеров и передвижных насосных станций по трубопроводам-шлангам в мобильные малые береговые цистерны ( по 0,5-1 КТ и на самой барже-танкере -250-500 т.

dr5r: АЧ-30 работали на тракторном керосине. М-50 на соляре или комплексном дизтопливе с цетановым числом не ниже 45


Пан директор: Ракетные катера 4х900 л.с. -- М-50 хотите обойтись? Можно, конечно, и 4 ГАМ-34, но если начинать с "до войны", всё-таки лучше бы проэкспериментировать, КМК, "отдельно". Прикинул минимальный дизель на 1800 л.с. без тоннелей: 60 градусов V12ДНСП19/31 -- коленвал и шатуны "примерно" немецкие, но увеличить диаметры шатунных и коренных шеек, увеличить противовесы, сократить ряд до шести цилиндров, долой крейцкопфы, в наличии длинные анкерные болты и головки блоков цилиндров практически как у АЧ-30 -- только газоходы из ГБЦ исключительно на выхлоп, АГТН и ресиверы воздуха в развал цилиндров. Я бы обошёлся таким, чтоб, в частности, поменьше места занимать унутре вместо 4х900 л.с. АЧ-30. С ресурсом и устойчивостью на волне будет вполне нормально -- широкие жёсткие алюмо-чугуняки. Никогда не слышал про размер 19/31. А обороты и вес какие?

dr5r: Немец же! МАН 9ДЦу19/31 двойного действия. Кромсаем его и переделываем. Отталкиваясь от некоторых его (самых дорогих, между прочим) деталей, можно запилить отличнейший мощный быстроходный дизель для корабельно/тепловозно/тяжелотанковых применений с приличным ресурсом, близкий по конструкции к 40Д. Обороты как в моём расчёте выше, не более 1050, скорей даже 900, мощи 1200 кВт, масса порядка 6-7 тонн, ресурс на полной мощности 1000+ часов.

von Echenbach: Ещё одна маленькая мимоходная идея: а если... взять относительно большой корпус с обводами "Люрсена" или "Воспера", в годах 25-30, также позаимствовать идею японских торпедных крейсеров, т.е. побортно 6-8 торпедных труб (6х2 + 1х2 на корме поворотный, бортовые м.б. фиксированы "ёлочкой" и м.б. 2 в носу, т.е 14-16 торпед) Люминий на трубы + противоосколочное прикрытие съёмное, и рубка, нос и палуба - 9-12 мм. В 150-250 т можно уложиться. Прочее вооружение - ? Предположительно: а) 1-2 76мм, 2 - 40/37, 2-4 - 20. 4-8 глуб. бомбы. б) 2-3-4 40, 4-20. 180-260 т, 42-6-2 (42-5-1,5), 3 винта и дизели - 32-36 уз. Вот, первый вариант проекта "шатко-валко-мокро" аи ТКА , аи Германия - СССР аи ТКА-нанокрейсер торпедный laid down 1932 Displacement: 193 t light; 200 t standard; 206 t normal; 210 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (143,34 ft / 137,80 ft) x 16,40 ft x (6,56 / 6,67 ft) (43,69 m / 42,00 m) x 5,00 m x (2,00 / 2,03 m) Armament: 3 - 1,57" / 40,0 mm 55,0 cal guns - 2,11lbs / 0,96kg shells, 550 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1932 Model 3 x Single mounts on centreline, evenly spread 4 - 0,79" / 20,0 mm 65,0 cal guns - 0,27lbs / 0,12kg shells, 850 per gun Auto rapid fire guns in deck mounts, 1932 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck forward 4 raised mounts Weight of broadside 7 lbs / 3 kg Main Torpedoes 12 - 17,7" / 450 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,859 t each, 10,302 t total In 6 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes Main DC/AS Mortars 2 - 110,23 lbs / 50,00 kg Depth Charges + 6 reloads - 0,394 t total in Stern depth charge racks Armour: - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,00" / 0 mm Forecastle: 0,00" / 0 mm Quarter deck: 0,35" / 9 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,35" / 9 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Diesel Internal combustion generators, Electric motors, 3 shafts, 14 424 shp / 10 761 Kw = 32,00 kts Range 400nm at 13,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 11 tons Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery Complement: 26 - 35 Cost: £0,111 million / $0,443 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 16 tons, 7,7% - Guns: 3 tons, 1,2% - Weapons: 13 tons, 6,5% Armour: 1 tons, 0,5% - Armour Deck: 1 tons, 0,4% - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 121 tons, 58,8% Hull, fittings & equipment: 55 tons, 26,9% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 12 tons, 6,0% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 46 lbs / 21 Kg = 23,7 x 1,6 " / 40 mm shells or 0,2 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,56 Metacentric height 0,7 ft / 0,2 m Roll period: 8,2 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 6 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,03 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0,01 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,485 / 0,488 Length to Beam Ratio: 8,40 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 13,61 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 86 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 36,00 degrees Stern overhang: 1,97 ft / 0,60 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 17,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Aft deck: 40,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Average freeboard: 5,69 ft / 1,73 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 193,9% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 51,7% Waterplane Area: 1 545 Square feet or 144 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 24% Structure weight / hull surface area: 22 lbs/sq ft or 107 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,54 - Longitudinal: 1,91 - Overall: 0,61 Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Ship has quick, lively roll, not a steady gun platform Caution: Lacks seaworthiness - very limited seakeeping ability

Пан директор: Многовато будет. Можно сделать по-проще и по-тихоходней Для конца 20-х/начала 30-х годов достаточно 150-160 тонн, два-три дизеля по 500-800 л.с. и скорость больше 20 узлов. Можно поставить одну-две 57-76-мм пушки из старых запасов и пулеметы. Плюс 4х450-2х533-мм ТА. Можно кроме торпедного делать малые канлодки и МОРЕХОДНЫЕ малые сторожевые корабли или спасательные катера. Например для поиска лётчиков, постановки дымзавес и сопровождения более крупных боевых кораблей.

von Echenbach: Не о кораблях. О подводных диверсантах-пловцах. Ж-И. Кусто создал свой акваланг в 1943-44 гг. Вероятно, под присмотром абвера (конспирологический аспект), но поскольку при работе первых аппаратов не было преимуществ перед аппаратами типа КИП-ИДА, то "пропустили". Развитие ДА подводного назначения в аи СССР с 30-го: что могло бы получиться?

von Echenbach: Катамараны-тримараны: в каких количествах строить на ТВД? В качестве СКР-Дес. кораблей, ТЩ- малых КЛ (в т.ч. и ПВО). При подсчётах мелочи - количество потребного растет в ужасающей прогрессии... :-) Всп. мобилизационные суда (и корабли дооснащенные/довооруженные) будут изначально, до 1935-36 гг на паровых машинах, позднее - дизели. Дизели - и на экспериментальных, малосерийных.

Пан директор: Да лучше вообще сделать нормальные десантные корабли. В первую очередь небольшие скоростыне МДК/СДК для техники. Например что бы корабль мог стандартное перевозить артбатарею дивизионных гаубиц с тягачами и запасом снарядов или взвод Т-34/КВ.

von Echenbach: Пан директор пишет: Да лучше вообще сделать нормальные десантные корабли. Совершенно согласен. Но "тогда" ещё не знали, какие будут "нормальные". Да в Аи хочется получить что-то эдакое, не совсем обычное. Отсюда и катамаранные ТЩ-ДК-ЗенКЛ и КЛ поддержки десанта...

von Echenbach: Высадочные средства: кроме мотоботов, тендеров и дес. барж можно применить экспериментальные-экзотические варианты. Такие, как: 1. Катера на воздушной подушке - модернизация идей Левкова, 2. катамараны и тримараны. Большие и малые. Малые - могут быть в подвесными моторами или винтами (мелководье, болота, скорость) - как боевой десантный вариант (9-17 чел, по 3-8 чел. в гондоле на поплавке, м.б. с бронезащитой). 3-4 на десантируемый взвод. 3. - ?

von Echenbach: Вариант проекта Десантного корабля-ТЩ-КЛ-СКР малого. аи Красный десантник, аи СССР Дес кор - ТЩ-КЛ laid down 1930 Displacement: 632 t light; 657 t standard; 666 t normal; 673 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (225,62 ft / 209,97 ft) x 29,53 ft x (7,22 / 7,28 ft) (68,77 m / 64,00 m) x 9,00 m x (2,20 / 2,22 m) Armament: 2 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 30,77lbs / 13,96kg shells, 150 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1930 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward 3 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 13,51lbs / 6,13kg shells, 250 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1930 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck aft 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 1 raised mount 2 - 1,77" / 45,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 2,80lbs / 1,27kg shells, 250 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1930 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck forward Weight of broadside 108 lbs / 49 kg Mines 2 - 2 204,62 lbs / 1 000,00 kg mines + 18 reloads - 19,684 t total in Above water - Stern racks/rails Main DC/AS Mortars 2 - 154,32 lbs / 70,00 kg Depth Charges + 12 reloads - 0,965 t total in Stern depth charge racks Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 1,57" / 40 mm 147,64 ft / 45,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 108% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,71" / 18 mm 0,35" / 9 mm - 3rd: 0,28" / 7 mm - - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,47" / 12 mm Forecastle: 0,00" / 0 mm Quarter deck: 0,71" / 18 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,00" / 0 mm, Aft 0,47" / 12 mm Machinery: Diesel Internal combustion motors, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 1 191 shp / 889 Kw = 14,00 kts Range 400nm at 11,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 16 tons Complement: 65 - 85 Cost: £0,136 million / $0,544 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 47 tons, 7,1% - Guns: 22 tons, 3,2% - Weapons: 26 tons, 3,9% Armour: 108 tons, 16,2% - Belts: 64 tons, 9,7% - Armament: 6 tons, 0,9% - Armour Deck: 37 tons, 5,6% - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 36 tons, 5,4% Hull, fittings & equipment: 241 tons, 36,1% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 34 tons, 5,1% Miscellaneous weights: 200 tons, 30,0% - Hull below water: 120 tons - Hull above water: 60 tons - On freeboard deck: 20 tons Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 1 557 lbs / 706 Kg = 51,0 x 3,9 " / 100 mm shells or 1,1 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,40 Metacentric height 1,4 ft / 0,4 m Roll period: 10,3 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 85 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,10 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,70 Hull form characteristics: Hull has raised forecastle, raised quarterdeck , a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,521 / 0,522 Length to Beam Ratio: 7,11 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 16,97 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 37,00 degrees Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 19,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Aft deck: 38,00%, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Average freeboard: 8,48 ft / 2,59 m Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 56,5% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 84,3% Waterplane Area: 4 382 Square feet or 407 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 154% Structure weight / hull surface area: 42 lbs/sq ft or 203 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 1,12 - Longitudinal: 1,81 - Overall: 1,17 Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather Можно строить упрощенный вариант - с двумя паровыми машинами (корма) и прямыми листами обшивки - для работы в качестве портовых средств и судов обеспечения флота. И в более сложном: с носовым лац-портом/аппарелью, более мощными дизелями - 18-21 уз и модернизированной артиллерией.

Пан директор: Нормальный десантный корабль, это корабль способный перевозить тяжелые/средние танки и артиллерию с тягачами. Думаю что оптимально когда 2-3-4 корабля перевозят роту Т-34, а это 11 танков + несколько грузовиков с пехотой и боеприпасами. Это уже будет огромное подспорье во всех моногочиленных десантах которые проводил ВМФ СССР в годы войны.

von Echenbach: Пан директор пишет: Это уже будет огромное подспорье во всех моногочиленных десантах которые проводил ВМФ СССР в годы войны. Эт точно. :-) Вариации на тему МН/СКР-Фрет-Трад Как для 1МВ или в 1925-30 для РИ, АВ, ФР, ИТ, ШВ, Голл, СССР и м.б. Рум, Пол, Герм. аи Фрет, аи СССР-АВ аи МН СКР ПВО laid down 1925 Displacement: 648 t light; 675 t standard; 703 t normal; 725 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (243,15 ft / 232,94 ft) x 21,33 ft x (9,84 / 10,07 ft) (74,11 m / 71,00 m) x 6,50 m x (3,00 / 3,07 m) Armament: 6 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 13,51lbs / 6,13kg shells, 250 per gun (3х1 100/45) Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1925 Model 2 x Twin mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread 1 x Twin mount on centreline, forward deck forward 4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 450 per gun Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1925 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft Weight of broadside 87 lbs / 40 kg Main Torpedoes 6 - 17,7" / 450 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,831 t each, 4,983 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted centre rotating tubes Main DC/AS Mortars 2 - 99,21 lbs / 45,00 kg Depth Charges + 18 reloads - 0,886 t total in Stern depth charge racks Armour: - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,31" / 8 mm 0,31" / 8 mm - 2nd: 0,24" / 6 mm - - Machinery: Oil fired boilers, steam turbines, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 14 260 shp / 10 638 Kw = 29,00 kts Range 900nm at 14,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 50 tons Complement: 67 - 88 Cost: £0,249 million / $0,995 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 24 tons, 3,4% - Guns: 13 tons, 1,8% - Weapons: 11 tons, 1,6% Armour: 7 tons, 1,1% - Armament: 7 tons, 1,1% Machinery: 349 tons, 49,7% Hull, fittings & equipment: 268 tons, 38,1% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 55 tons, 7,8% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 299 lbs / 136 Kg = 22,3 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,13 Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m Roll period: 11,4 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 51 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,33 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,02 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,503 / 0,507 Length to Beam Ratio: 10,92 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 17,30 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 72 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 21,00 degrees Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 17,00%, 18,04 ft / 5,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Forward deck: 26,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Aft deck: 44,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m - Average freeboard: 12,29 ft / 3,75 m Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 167,8% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 90,1% Waterplane Area: 3 452 Square feet or 321 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 72% Structure weight / hull surface area: 31 lbs/sq ft or 152 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,69 - Longitudinal: 5,78 - Overall: 0,85 Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room

von Echenbach: Возвращаясь к десантным средствам - попытка №222 ;-)) Морской десантный мотобот дмзмтб-40, аи ссср дес мор мтб laid down 1940 Barbette ship Displacement: 52 t light; 55 t standard; 55 t normal; 55 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (58,74 ft / 55,77 ft) x 16,40 ft x (3,28 / 3,29 ft) (17,90 m / 17,00 m) x 5,00 m x (1,00 / 1,00 m) Armament: 1 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 45,0 cal gun - 13,51lbs / 6,13kg shells, 150 per gun Dual purpose gun in open barbette mount, 1940 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 1 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 50,0 cal gun - 1,64lbs / 0,74kg shells, 450 per gun Auto rapid fire gun in open barbette mount, 1940 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck aft 2 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm 55,0 cal guns - 0,07lbs / 0,03kg shells, 950 per gun Auto rapid fire guns in open barbette mounts, 1940 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward Weight of broadside 15 lbs / 7 kg Mines 2 - 220,46 lbs / 100,00 kg mines + 4 reloads - 0,591 t total in Above water - Stern racks/rails Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 0,71" / 18 mm 32,81 ft / 10,00 m 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Ends: 0,47" / 12 mm 19,69 ft / 6,00 m 1,64 ft / 0,50 m 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Unarmoured ends Main Belt covers 90% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 1,57" / 40 mm 0,71" / 18 mm 1,42" / 36 mm 2nd: 0,47" / 12 mm - 0,94" / 24 mm 3rd: 0,24" / 6 mm - 0,47" / 12 mm - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,47" / 12 mm Forecastle: 0,47" / 12 mm Quarter deck: 0,47" / 12 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,71" / 18 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Diesel Internal combustion motors, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 123 shp / 92 Kw = 9,00 kts Range 100nm at 6,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 1 tons Complement: 9 - 13 Cost: £0,021 million / $0,083 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 6 tons, 11,2% - Guns: 5 tons, 9,8% - Weapons: 1 tons, 1,3% Armour: 13 tons, 23,4% - Belts: 5 tons, 8,3% - Armament: 2 tons, 3,1% - Armour Deck: 6 tons, 11,6% - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,4% Machinery: 3 tons, 6,0% Hull, fittings & equipment: 10 tons, 17,6% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 3 tons, 5,6% Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 36,3% - Hull below water: 15 tons - On freeboard deck: 3 tons - Above deck: 2 tons Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 85 lbs / 39 Kg = 6,4 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,89 Metacentric height 0,9 ft / 0,3 m Roll period: 7,2 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 29 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,05 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0,33 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,643 / 0,644 Length to Beam Ratio: 3,40 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 9,29 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 65 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 51 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 39,00 degrees Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 23,00%, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m - Forward deck: 36,00%, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m - Aft deck: 29,00%, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m - Quarter deck: 12,00%, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m, 2,30 ft / 0,70 m - Average freeboard: 2,50 ft / 0,76 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 70,6% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 39,2% Waterplane Area: 726 Square feet or 67 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 109% Structure weight / hull surface area: 16 lbs/sq ft or 79 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,73 - Longitudinal: 2,11 - Overall: 0,81 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space Extremely poor accommodation and workspace room Ship has quick, lively roll, not a steady gun platform Caution: Lacks seaworthiness - very limited seakeeping ability арт. вариант: 2 122 гаубицы на корме, СКР-ПВО вариант - 2 - 76 на корме, 2 - 37 (нос, борт) и 2 12,7. Всп. причал-ТЩ: 2 12,7 (2 - 37-мм), свободная палуба и 2-4 3-5-т краны. У дес. и причального вариантов выдвижной трехсекционный пандус на 12 м.

von Echenbach: Малый СКР ПВО-ПЛО ВОХР 1931. Идеология частично из дискуссии http://fai.org.ru/forum/topic/41515-mikro-kreyser/?page=11 Ошибочно поставил в тему по "проблемным аи-кораблям", сейчас перенес текст. laid down 1931 Displacement: 451 t light; 473 t standard; 500 t normal; 521 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (232,17 ft / 219,82 ft) x 19,69 ft x (7,22 / 7,45 ft) (70,76 m / 67,00 m) x 6,00 m x (2,20 / 2,27 m) Armament: 6 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 13,51lbs / 6,13kg shells, 250 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1931 Model 2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread 1 x 2-gun mount on centreline, forward deck forward 4 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 55,0 cal guns - 1,67lbs / 0,76kg shells, 450 per gun Auto rapid fire guns in deck mounts, 1931 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft 4 raised mounts Weight of broadside 88 lbs / 40 kg Main Torpedoes 4 - 17,7" / 450 mm, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m torpedoes - 0,716 t each, 2,866 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes Main DC/AS Mortars 2 - 110,23 lbs / 50,00 kg Depth Charges + 18 reloads - 0,984 t total in Stern depth charge racks 2nd DC/AS Mortars 2 - 110,23 lbs / 50,00 kg Depth Charges + 8 reloads - 0,492 t total in Depth charge throwers Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 0,47" / 12 mm 134,51 ft / 41,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 94% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,55" / 14 mm 0,28" / 7 mm - 2nd: 0,35" / 9 mm - - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,47" / 12 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,47" / 12 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Diesel Internal combustion motors, No drive to shaft, 2 shafts, 4 196 shp / 3 130 Kw = 22,00 kts Range 800nm at 16,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 47 tons Complement: 52 - 68 Cost: £0,166 million / $0,662 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 25 tons, 4,9% - Guns: 19 tons, 3,8% - Weapons: 6 tons, 1,1% Armour: 51 tons, 10,2% - Belts: 17 tons, 3,4% - Armament: 9 tons, 1,9% - Armour Deck: 24 tons, 4,8% - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 125 tons, 25,1% Hull, fittings & equipment: 249 tons, 49,9% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 49 tons, 9,8% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 660 lbs / 300 Kg = 49,3 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,9 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,02 Metacentric height 0,5 ft / 0,1 m Roll period: 12,3 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 59 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,43 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,18 Hull form characteristics: Hull has raised forecastle, rise forward of midbreak, raised quarterdeck , a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,560 / 0,565 Length to Beam Ratio: 11,17 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 16,68 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 61 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 31,00 degrees Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 17,00%, 15,09 ft / 4,60 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 27,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Aft deck: 43,00%, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Average freeboard: 9,12 ft / 2,78 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 92,5% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 88,8% Waterplane Area: 3 174 Square feet or 295 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 145% Structure weight / hull surface area: 42 lbs/sq ft or 208 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 1,24 - Longitudinal: 3,58 - Overall: 1,38 Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room можно заменить 3х2 76 на 3х1 100

von Echenbach: Размышлялось - в какую тему. Более всего подходят "персики", но потеряется для аи СССР ПЛ крейсерского типа. Во внешнем, легком корпусе - 10 гигантских 760-мм торпед (35 уз на 12 миль, 600-800 кг БЧ, вес торпеды - ? до 4-6 т. :). Перезарядка - с ТР или в базе. Для самообороны и по малым ТР - 6+6 в прочном корпусе перезаряжаемых (+6-12 запас) 380-мм сверхбыстроходных (650 кг, БЧ - 100-150 кг, скорость на 10 каб - 60 уз, на 30 каб - 40 уз). аи ПЛ "суперЩука", аи СССР ПЛ аи 760+380 laid down 1935 Displacement: 976 t light; 1 003 t standard; 1 052 t normal; 1 092 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (222,09 ft / 219,82 ft) x 22,97 ft x (13,12 / 13,51 ft) (67,69 m / 67,00 m) x 7,00 m x (4,00 / 4,12 m) Armament: 2 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 30,77lbs / 13,96kg shells, 150 per gun Dual purpose guns in deck mounts, 1935 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread Weight of broadside 62 lbs / 28 kg Main Torpedoes 10 - 29,9" / 760 mm, 32,81 ft / 10,00 m torpedoes - 4,119 t each, 41,193 t total submerged bow & stern tubes 2nd Torpedoes 12 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,672 t each, 8,069 t total submerged bow & stern tubes Machinery: Diesel Internal combustion generators, Electric motors, 2 shafts, 3 311 shp / 2 470 Kw = 18,00 kts Range 2 800nm at 11,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 90 tons Complement: 92 - 120 Cost: £0,256 million / $1,025 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 110 tons, 10,5% - Guns: 12 tons, 1,1% - Weapons: 99 tons, 9,4% Machinery: 94 tons, 8,9% Hull, fittings & equipment: 752 tons, 71,4% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 76 tons, 7,2% Miscellaneous weights: 20 tons, 1,9% - Hull below water: 20 tons Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): -594 lbs / -269 Kg = -19,5 x 3,9 " / 100 mm shells or NaN torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,10 Metacentric height 0,7 ft / 0,2 m Roll period: 11,9 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 53 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,13 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,07 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a normal bow and small transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,556 / 0,561 Length to Beam Ratio: 9,57 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 15,88 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 11,00 degrees Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 15,00%, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Aft deck: 44,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Quarter deck: 11,00%, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m - Average freeboard: 8,19 ft / 2,50 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): -174,0% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 66,7% Waterplane Area: 3 631 Square feet or 337 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 445% Structure weight / hull surface area: 112 lbs/sq ft or 547 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 2,83 - Longitudinal: 6,11 - Overall: 3,05 Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room

von Echenbach: Ближе к РИ - попытка усилить вооружение МО-4 в отношении ПВО: 2 - 37, 3х2 12,7, 10 ГБ. МО-ПВО-4 МЗА, аи СССР катер СКА-ПВО laid down 1941 Displacement: 56 t light; 58 t standard; 61 t normal; 64 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (85,09 ft / 82,02 ft) x 13,12 ft x (3,61 / 3,72 ft) (25,94 m / 25,00 m) x 4,00 m x (1,10 / 1,13 m) Armament: 2 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 1,56lbs / 0,71kg shells, 450 per gun Auto rapid fire guns in deck mounts, 1941 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread 6 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm 55,0 cal guns - 0,07lbs / 0,03kg shells, 950 per gun Machine guns in deck mounts, 1941 Model 2 x Twin mounts on sides, forward deck aft 1 x Twin mount on centreline, forward deck forward Weight of broadside 4 lbs / 2 kg Main DC/AS Mortars 2 - 110,23 lbs / 50,00 kg Depth Charges + 8 reloads - 0,492 t total in Stern depth charge racks Armour: - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,28" / 7 mm - - 2nd: 0,28" / 7 mm - - - Conning towers: Forward 0,28" / 7 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Petrol Internal combustion motors, Geared drive, 4 shafts, 3 026 shp / 2 257 Kw = 24,00 kts Range 600nm at 11,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 5 tons Complement: 10 - 14 Cost: £0,043 million / $0,173 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 2 tons, 3,1% - Guns: 1 tons, 2,1% - Weapons: 1 tons, 1,0% Armour: 3 tons, 4,8% - Armament: 3 tons, 4,6% - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,2% Machinery: 33 tons, 54,2% Hull, fittings & equipment: 18 tons, 29,3% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 5 tons, 8,6% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 22 lbs / 10 Kg = 14,3 x 1,5 " / 37 mm shells or 0,1 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,86 Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m Roll period: 6,8 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 4 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,02 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0,01 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,554 / 0,559 Length to Beam Ratio: 6,25 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 10,69 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 87 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 23,00 degrees Stern overhang: 0,98 ft / 0,30 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 17,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 3,94 ft / 1,20 m - Forward deck: 28,00%, 3,94 ft / 1,20 m, 3,94 ft / 1,20 m - Aft deck: 42,00%, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 3,28 ft / 1,00 m, 3,94 ft / 1,20 m - Average freeboard: 3,69 ft / 1,12 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 181,4% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 53,0% Waterplane Area: 785 Square feet or 73 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 37% Structure weight / hull surface area: 17 lbs/sq ft or 83 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,68 - Longitudinal: 1,92 - Overall: 0,76 Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Ship has quick, lively roll, not a steady gun platform Caution: Lacks seaworthiness - very limited seakeeping ability

von Echenbach: аи Десантный бронекатер аи десантный штурмовой БКА, аи СССР аи БКА-1124 laid down 1941 Barbette ship с РС 82 - 24-48 или 130 12-18 Displacement: 54 t light; 56 t standard; 56 t normal; 56 t full load Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (89,13 ft / 85,30 ft) x 13,12 ft x (3,28 / 3,29 ft) (27,17 m / 26,00 m) x 4,00 m x (1,00 / 1,00 m) Armament: 1 - 1,46" / 37,0 mm 55,0 cal gun - 1,67lbs / 0,76kg shells, 350 per gun Auto rapid fire gun in open barbette mount, 1941 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 2 - 0,50" / 12,7 mm 55,0 cal guns - 0,07lbs / 0,03kg shells, 850 per gun Machine guns in deck mounts, 1941 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft Weight of broadside 2 lbs / 1 kg Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 0,71" / 18 mm 59,06 ft / 18,00 m 4,92 ft / 1,50 m Ends: 0,35" / 9 mm 26,25 ft / 8,00 m 4,92 ft / 1,50 m Main Belt covers 107% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,47" / 12 mm 0,24" / 6 mm 0,71" / 18 mm 2nd: 0,24" / 6 mm - - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,47" / 12 mm Forecastle: 0,24" / 6 mm Quarter deck: 0,35" / 9 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,00" / 0 mm, Aft 0,47" / 12 mm Machinery: Petrol Internal combustion motors, Geared drive, 2 shafts, 307 shp / 229 Kw = 13,00 kts Range 50nm at 9,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 1 tons Complement: 9 - 13 Cost: £0,020 million / $0,081 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 1 tons, 2,2% - Guns: 1 tons, 2,2% Armour: 19 tons, 33,3% - Belts: 11 tons, 18,7% - Armament: 1 tons, 2,4% - Armour Deck: 7 tons, 12,0% - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,3% Machinery: 8 tons, 14,5% Hull, fittings & equipment: 11 tons, 19,9% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 2 tons, 3,4% Miscellaneous weights: 15 tons, 26,7% - Hull below water: 10 tons - Hull above water: 3 tons - On freeboard deck: 2 tons Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 73 lbs / 33 Kg = 47,4 x 1,5 " / 37 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,53 Metacentric height 0,5 ft / 0,1 m Roll period: 7,9 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 34 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,02 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0,48 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and large transom stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,535 / 0,536 Length to Beam Ratio: 6,50 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 10,89 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 62 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 24,00 degrees Stern overhang: 1,64 ft / 0,50 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 16,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m - Forward deck: 44,00%, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m, 4,92 ft / 1,50 m - Aft deck: 28,00%, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m - Quarter deck: 12,00%, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m, 1,64 ft / 0,50 m - Average freeboard: 3,61 ft / 1,10 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 77,0% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 61,9% Waterplane Area: 802 Square feet or 74 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 108% Structure weight / hull surface area: 11 lbs/sq ft or 53 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,62 - Longitudinal: 1,08 - Overall: 0,65 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Excellent machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Caution: Lacks seaworthiness - very limited seakeeping ability в эту тему дубль для общего собрания.



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